Defines “ages”. Blue leds came out of Japan somewhat recently and that’s pretty huge
Veritasium has an awesome video about the Japanese scientist that discovered blue LEDs, guy basically did it single handedly despite pushback from his boss. Absolutely insane scientific achievement
Ground breaking AI🤡
Their AI needs longer to develop cause it has to be folded a million times.
They have impure silicon there so their software dev practices had to become way more advanced to compensate
Found the Japanese sword enthusiast.
dude had already swallowed the tech bs, thinks ai is the furthest advancement of technology when it can’t compete with ancient tech. literally can’t do what a calculator can do reliably. or a timer. or a calendar.
Please let’s try to keep generative AI from claiming the entire word “AI”.
Current generative AI is good at and built for mimicking patterns with boundary conditions.
This means it does a decent job of imitating authoritative knowledge, but it’s just mimicking it.
People are hyped for it because it looks knowledgeable, it’s relatively simple to make, and a lot of what we do is text based so it’s easy to apply.There are a lot of other types of AI, the majority even, that work significantly better, take a small fraction of the computing power and provide helpful and meaningful results. They just don’t look like anything other than complex math, which is all any of them are in the end.
A calculator, timer or calendar can’t help me write an essay. You are comparing tools meant for different tasks. At least build your argumentets on something reasonable.
Take an English class you illiterate gremlin.
Resource intense auto correct that does not understand the information it’s stringing together should not be used to write anything academically or professionally.
If you don’t want to use all the tools at your desposal, that’s your choice. If I had a tool that could help me formulate my text into the proper tense and help me use words most suited for a academic setting, why should I not use it? Did you know that writing a paper is part of university stuides, English major or not?
Or do you not understand how to use an LLM? Do you think that one just prompts it and use whatever it produces? That is just as stupid as entering random number into a calculator, excpect it to calculate what you wanted and then say ”caluclators are bad because it gave the wrong answer”.
Learn to add together big numbers in your head
And that has to do with writing essays how?
A calculator, timer or calendar can’t help me write an essay.
Those are all tools, you’re bashing this guy for using one of them, so I’m bashing you for using a calculator. I’m pretty sure that you used one once in your life
Oh I see, you didn’t catch my meaning that AI is a shitty tool for even the thing OP was talking about.
I refer you to my first comment as guidance on how you can improve your reading comprehension.
Why argue with someone who isn’t intelligent enough to write their essays without mechanical assistance?
I want a more diverse discussion about LLM and AI, not the default ”AI bad” response that is so common here. :(
I wonder why anyone would want an “AI girlfriend” or whatever ridiculous thing tech bros are trying to shoehorn monetization into to capitalize on the pervasive disconnect in society today.
And then, when I read a post like yours, referring to someone like that, it all suddenly makes sense. Given the choice, I’d also rather spend time with unthinking silicon than an asshole who talks to people like you do.
Weak argument, dude
Did you use your computers spell check, ever? Cuz you’d fall for your own smart-assery if you did
“Why argue with someone who needs something else to write the essay for them” might be better
funny how it’s not “intelligent” enough to say “hey I don’t really do math” and instead feeds me bullshit that I have to correct and then it’ll say “oh yeah totally right sorry here’s the actual answer that I wouldn’t have given if you hadn’t corrected me as the one who asked the question”
also your essay fucking sucks. learn to put together a coherent thought instead of relying on a glorified autocorrect that doesn’t have them at all to do it for you.
funny how it’s not “intelligent” enough to say “hey I don’t really do math”
From what I understand, that is how OpenAI has decided to make their LLM and not an inherit property of LLMs, but I could you be wrong.
also your essay fucking sucks
Did you read it?
learn to put together a coherent thought instead of relying on a glorified autocorrect that doesn’t have them at all to do it for you.
I’ll take a guess here. You think I had the LLM write my essey for me. You also think I used it to correct my spelling.
I already have other software that can help me with my spelling, so that was not needed. I wrote my whole essey first, because actually doing myself is faster and gives a better result than trying to prompt an AI to do it, at least for me.What I did do was feed my text into an LLM to see how I could improve the structure of my text, how tense could be used correctly and if any words that I used could be changed for a better substitute. All of those are things that I could do myself, but I had an excellent tool to help me with it so I used it.
Not using it would be just as stupid as not using a software to correct spelling becuase it might get the spelling wrong.
I think you do not understand how to get the most out of an LLM or you are using it wrong. Or both.
I don’t exactly keep up with the technological innovations of every country, but I get the feeling it isn’t so much that Japan hasn’t innovated in decades, so much as they haven’t done anything he (it’s 4chan, let’s be frank, it’s a he) personally finds interesting or that is publicized in the medium he gets his news from.
Japan still generally places more emphasis on quality over shitting out shiny new, overpriced garbage as fast as possible
Doc: “No wonder this circuit failed; it says ‘Made in Japan’.”
Marty: “What do you mean, Doc? All the best stuff is made in Japan.”What was the joke supposed to be here, that they had rapidly industrialised.
I think they had a poor reputation and then rapidly improved which led to their current reputation
They started out like China, making cheaper copies of Western tech. Then they started to innovate.
China is now on exactly the same path, and it’s well into the phase where they are innovating, but most people still refuse to acknowledge that.
Western tech had a massive head start.
When a country’s tech manufacturing is being developed it’s going to start by making what already exists because… it has to start somewhere.
It didn’t take long for Japanese cars to supersede American cars. China is now doing the same to both American and Japanese cars. Nissan nearly went out of business and is still in trouble. Tesla’s situation isn’t helped by how dislikable its founder is so its value is plumetting.
Most countries don’t know how to deal with the advent Chinese EVs so they’re just slapping massive tariffs on them and hoping they figure something out in the meantime.
It isn’t just going to stop at Japan and China though. Japan was subsidized by the US post WW2 and China built its manufacturing from the ground up. There are many other countries on that path which will lead to significant global competition. The West is going to have to keep its head up if it wants to remain competitive by the end of the century.
The leading Western nation responding to increased global competition with reactionary protectionism is a bad start. It’s squandering all of the soft power the US has cultivated post WW2 leaving a power vacuum for China and other influential nations on the ascension to capitalize on.
It’s also worth noting that, economically, it’s not surprising that the country with the most people would have the largest economy.
There’s nothing fundamentally different between the people of the US and China beyond the conditions they’re born in. Insofar as innovation is a product of economics, educational investment, opportunity for innovation and a random chance it happens, and economic strength is a product of innovation and raw work output, it follows that more people leads to more work output, and eventually to a larger, more innovative economy.
A disorganized China and some key innovation breakthroughs by the west last century gave a significant headstart, and some of Maos more unwise choices slowed their catch-up, but it’s not surprising that an organized country with five times the US population would surpass us in economics and innovation, to say nothing of being competitive.
Really? Isn’t it pretty obvious, I mean they make electric cars now.
Yeah but a lot of people still don’t realize that they make better electric cars now.
Because AI software isn’t ground breaking and is actually useless
I had some use of it. It is really good at summing and organizing a bunch of text.
So good in fact that apple spawned a whole new category of memes making fun of how badly that works.
Yes AI has good uses, it made my job faster, I can now focus on more important things because I’m not wasting time with bullshit that AI can do in a seccond.
But you can’t say that on Lemmy, here it’s all useless, a scam and gave my dog AIDS.
A lot of people here on Lemmy keeps saying that AI is bad because it failed one task it wasn’t built for. Or because it can’t do everything. I don’t get it.
maybe go for a “its bad because of the return on investment” angle? for the amount of literal billions we have thrown at it, perhaps its ok to expect more. if you gave me a mere couple of billion, i’d make healthy lunches for school kids to foster education and health outcomes (2-4-1!)
I haven’t spent billions on it, so it is not a bad ROI for me. Perhaps it is for those who has invested in creating OpenAI, LLama etc, I am not one of them.
Spending the same amount of money to create a better world would be ideal. But if the money was not spent on AI development does not mean that it would be spent on anything better. That is also a discussion about the money spent on AI and if it has been worth it (a discussion very much wroth having), it does not diminish the usefulness of AIs.
How many billions (in today’s money) were spent on going to the moon? What about the billions poured into refining the internal combustion engine? The billions that have gone into making and running massive particle accelerators?
Technology is constantly advancing and we often don’t know where it’ll take us until we get there.
Name one category of tasks that you would feel confident it can perform with at least a 90% success rate.
Improve text that I have written. With improve I mean change the text accodring to the specifications in the prompt provided to the AI.
Here are a few more:
- Since ChatGPT has parsed most of the puplic internet, it can be useful when trying to find information about something that is very obscure - (for example settings for an old or not as used software), where my ordinary searches has failed me.
- In addition to the previous one, it can be good way to find better search terms.
- Write repeated text with slight variations that I could do myself but an AI can do instantly.
- Translate and XSD (XML specification) into another structure (for example classes when writing code).
- Create macros for World of Warcraft.
- Explain errors outputed buy some software (ties into the first two).
I am sure there are other usecases that I could not think of.
Is the money, time and energy spent to create a tool that can do this worth it? That is perhaps the question want to ask and perhaps your answer is no.
Making up bullshit. It never failed me yet…
The idea that Japan was ever more technologically advanced than the US is a tough argument to make. Perhaps they had better consumer and transportation technologies, but the US led the world in nearly all other forms of technology (see silicon valley, NASA, US defense technology, etc). It’s cool the hate on the US but there’s a reason it was the world super power for decades. It’s too bad it’s turning into an anti-science christo-facist kelptocracy.
I think it’s mostly that they did way better than the US in terms of making many consumer technology products widely available at a higher quality and better cost than the US did. Like, Japanese brands were huge for televisions, audio equipment and similar goods. I can think of several that were the go to brands for TVs when I was growing up, but I can’t think of a single US-based manufacturer, even a crappy one.
They also did way better in terms of building out internet access and public transport than the US has done.
It might only be within a few limited sectors, but when those sectors account for the vast majority of peoples’ interactions with technology, it’s going to have a far greater impact on their perceptions of relative advancement.
Also, in the pre-internet days, it probably helped that non-Japanese people largely didn’t see all the ways that Japan can be an extremely conservative country, like their reliance on fax machines long after pretty much every other country with the means to do so had almost entirely left them behind as obsolete.
RCA, Westinghouse, and Zenith used to be big American TV manufacturers. Westinghouse and zenith were the cheaper brands, but RCA used to make some high end models.
I mean, I know there had to have been some, but 2/3 of those are out of business and weren’t competitive with their Japanese rivals, while Zenith’s most recent “notable product” on Wikipedia dates from the 1970s and has been a subsidiary of a Korean company for nearly 30 years.
And Curtis Mathis
The tech for silicon valley comes from Asia. You literally couldn’t build a chip factory in the US right now, the know-how doesn’t exist there anymore.
So the US is leading the world in writing code and building long tubes spewing hot gas out of one end.yahoo, billion dollar missiles!
You go back far enough and you’ll find every country did horrible things or stolelands or killed half their citizens etc.
Yes we are good at those, also, in addition to most other tech.
to be fair it’s always been a kleptocracy. literally founded on stolen land, with stolen labor. even after emancipation it kept the stolen labor tradition alive til now with increasing intensity.
honestly youd be pretty hard pressed to find a country now that wasnt previously stolen
Sure but the scale and recency of European colonialism certainly leaves a bad taste in many people’s mouths, even the descendants of colonists.
Many are also put off by European and its new world colony’s claims of moral supremacy over those victimized by colonization, especially as it was the birthplace of nazi-ism and countless genocides.
We can all agree thar humans have been nafarious for a long time. But, many see the legacy of European colonialism and the Trans Atlantic slave trade as an atrocity at a scale never before commited in human history.
different degrees, but yeah pretty much all land has been taken by force. still is. the difference is how though.
Eh, they seemed to have better access to new tech like phones, though most of that seems to have shifted to Korea these days.
Japan has been living in the year 2000 since 1980.
The last good year. Truly they are the most intellectually advanced society.
Except no one can get laid apparently
According to my research all of their genitals are pixelated. What did they expect?
They have 2d waifus, who needs women?
And they’re a bunch of xenophobic racists.
Thought you were talking about America’s elected government for a second there.
So it’s exactly like my year 2000, too!
Oh you can if you have money, just head to Soapland in Tokyo.
What happened after 2000 that made everythimg bad?
9/11
I forgor 💀
Fuck you, actually making me laugh out loud at something
Social media maybe?
Social Media didn’t exist yet was all user groups, mailing list, irc, and AOL chat rooms. Would be another 4-5 years before they came onto the scene as we know it today
Wish I developed a brain sooner to enjoy that age properly…;_;
intellectually advanced society.
How do you even measure that?
I genuinely think using generative AIs to do your job for you should be grounds for immediate termination under just cause.
Machines have no agency and can never be held responsible for anything, thus should never be put under professional responsibility.
I can’t wait for these models to colapse onto themselves.
The Plaza Accord happened. Japan was also demonized in media and politics like China is now.
Economics Explained has an interesting video on the topic. After WWII, Japan became the first country in Asia to undergo an industrial revolution and soon became the second largest economy after the US and was by many accounts set to match or even overtake the US. They then suffered an economic collapse due to unchecked growth and speculative markets and decided to never again speculate on the future and just stick to tried and true methods.
Since the 1990s, Japan’s economy has barely changed while other nations have seen huge growth. You’d assume that would mean Japan is now far behind, but they aren’t. They seem to have mastered keeping everything the same for decades without the normal decline that comes with it.
And that, actually, is a great thing. You don’t want explosive growth, you want stability. This is a lesson the US is learning right now
I spend at least a month in Japan every year and the tech there is great for the most part. All of the critical parts infrastructure tech is brilliant and incredibly stable.
The lack of risk taking is very noticeable though especially when it comes to contemporary software and UX. There just so much broken tech because everything moves so slowly - for example to pick up a reserved train tickets you need to bring the same physical card you made you payment with and thats the only way. So if you used a virtual card or forgot your card at home you’re screwed.
After WWII, Japan became the first country in Asia to undergo an industrial revolution
After WW2? Industrialization during the 20s/30s was the whole reason they attempted to conqueror the Oceanic island states and the Chinese/Korean/Indochinese mainland.
They then suffered an economic collapse due to unchecked growth and speculative markets and decided to never again speculate on the future and just stick to tried and true methods.
The Japanese Economy was undone by The Plaza Accord and The Louvre Accord, which western nations used to devalue their currency and undermine Japanese export prices. The downturn, followed by a financialized corporate consolidation and expropriation of revenues through foreign investment, permanently crippled the Japanese economy in the aftermath of the 90s Asian recession.
What sets countries like Japan, Korea, and the Philippines apart from China is the domestic control of their industries. Their markets are dominated by private equity and fixated on steady profit margins rather than long term public investments. Consequently, the capital cities are flooded with cash and industrial development while the rural areas are devoid of commerce. There’s no shortage of speculation, but its rooted in the private equity markets and focused largely on fictitious capital - debt instruments and their derivatives - rather than real capital or technology.
Chinese investment in the periphery and its rising tide of middle class wage earners is what propels them into the 21st century. They’re the ones building out new transit lines, new public housing projects, new universities, and blue sky research. The Xi Government is openly hostile to speculative investment, doesn’t bother to bail out failing financial institutions, and focuses primarily on expansion of utilities, trade corridors, and mixed us developments.
Japan is on the verge if major economic collapse if they do not increase the population
No, they’re absolutely not. Their GDP will majorly decline, but their QOL will stay the same or even improve and their GDP per capita also won’t see much change.
Birtherism is bullshit.
I’m interested to know how you believe the elderly will be cared for? Let’s assume for a moment they have no issues financially supporting the elderly, but physically who is supposed to care for them? Who will make up the nurses, doctors and caretakers now that their population pyramid looks like a chicken drumstick?
Japan has a large amount of unused labor in the current demographic breakup of 29% elderly, Japan has a large number of educated inviduals, and Japan has a large amount of capital even without infinite growth shenanigans.
Any failure to take care elderly even at 38% or even 50% would be a failure of the state as a result of greed or corruption. It’s a relatively simple task to accomplish. The year is 2025, automation replaced most other jobs a long long time ago.
Their nation needs tax revenue. That depends on having people to tax. If the population declines too much they cannot afford to maintain social services and QoL will decline.
None of this is particularly controversial or surprising.
The services’ costs are dependent on the number of recipients. They’re already in the slump of elderly being a drain on the system, it can only get better not worse.
The only concern of the population decline that I can see is the decrease in funding available for Military Expenses.
And, if things get really bad, all they have to do is open up for immigration and able bodied workers will magically appear.
You are the only person I have seen claiming the elder population of Japan is decreasing or that there is light at the end of the tunnel.
https://www.ipss.go.jp/pp-zenkoku/e/zenkoku_e2023/pp2023e_PressRelease.pdf
Japan might not get the right immigrants at the right time. They shouldn’t count on skilled labor appearing when they need it.
If Generation A has a higher number of people than Generation B then when Generation A dies off there will be a lower number of elderly. It’s a temporary slump. It might last a decade or more, but it is temporary.
According to your source the Percentage of people aged over 65 peaks in 2042 or 2043 at about 38% if the government does nothing, compared to the 29.6% currently.
Right now a lot of skilled workers are fleeing to the EU, so Japan could totally capitalize on that. Or it can just educate its population to be skilled labor and give all the low skilled labor (if that even exists) to immigrants. Immigrants work hard for lower wages and are less prone to crime, there is no good faith argument against that.
The projected population of elderly people is projected to be 40% of the total population within 50 years unless substantial shifts happen. They are not replacing workers fast enough.
Japan has never wanted more immigrants and soon they will need a LOT of immigrants. Japan’s traditional xenophobia might prevent them for getting enough people.
They’ll survive it, their markets and investments aren’t overvalued like ours are. They’ll crash, re-evaluate their societal priorities, and start to build again
That’s an incredibly optimistic outlook.
hard to function with a negative outlook
I mean every society has to rebuild after a crash, I’m just optimistic that they’ll do it faster
You might want to look into the population studies on Japan. They are pretty bleak
Got a summary? I know the onus is on me, but I’m not likely to dig much further
Within 50 years the population will shrink to 70% of current levels with 40ish percent of the total population being elderly.
That’d require significant societal change to an environment where having children is actually manageable
Which is why this is a problem
Honestly, sounds great to me. I know they’ve had “issues” (is it really an issue for me if my money becomes more valuable?) with deflation, but I’d be OK with that if it meant no more speculation.
I hate inflation based economics. So ngl, japan seems really nice in that regard
The US isn’t innovating jack shit.
The US just created a massively polarized and unequal society so that when a country creates a new brilliant researcher or innovation, an American company can buy them out.
Basically, the insane poverty and lack of government services that the average American experiences gives them enough cash to buy up innovative people, companies, and competitors.
Also the post-WW2 world order heavily favours their economy.
Their allies buy their debt, and their weapons. They give access to theiir markets to US companies, and support US wars around the world. They invest in the US economy in an unbalanced way that favours the US economy.
And all of this was in exchange for US security.
Innovate people, companies, and competitors
And quickly turn them complacent. I work at a Japanese company, and the amount of times I see an amazing Japanese expat turn into a busybody is insane. We have crafted the perfect “fuck your idea just do your job” culture
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Y’all are so jaded
No, we just don’t mislabel foreign brain drain as American exceptionalism.
Same thing that happens everywhere. Low cost innovation gets expensive as companies grow and salaries rise, profit seekers move to exploit cheaper labor elsewhere.
That still hasn’t happened in the US though. Hardware is produced overseas but a huge chunk of the most used software in the world is produced in the US. The chips are designed in the US, some produced here but most overseas. Does that only apply to manufacturing?
Still hasn’t happened in the US? You choose a single industry as an indicator to base a claim on the state of US industry vs vast manufacturing losses the US has faced over the last 50 years?
Whatever. If it’s Linux, Democrat, anti establishment, and anti US then it’s popular on Lemmy, got it. Lemmy feels more and more like it’s just a big group of edgy teenagers.
