It’s interesting how just a few instances of surprise rejection early in life can have a big effect on personality. I ended up paranoid, always assuming that no one could really like me and anyone who acted as if he or she did was just pitying me or playing some cruel prank on me that I was too socially inept to see.
It got to the point that when I went to a school dance (I didn’t want to but my parents made me) and the prettiest girl in the class asked me to dance with her, I actually got upset. I couldn’t believe that she sincerely wanted to. I said yes because it would have been rude to say no, but I was convinced that everybody including her was secretly laughing at me.
I only considered the possibility that she was sincere years later, when I was an adult, but even now my brain is telling me “Nah, loser, she just felt sorry for you.”
It felt so weird when I got to college and started working and people were just treating me like a normal person. It took a long time for me to stop defaulting to trying to figure out what kind of trick they were playing on me. I still don’t know wtf I did wrong as a child that made everyone decide I was to be ostracized.
I am currently doing my bachelor in padagogical science and I can ensure you that group dynamics and individuals position in those groups very seldom have anything to do with the individual. There are contributing factors in all personalities involved, but it more often comes down to how a group is situated in what context. Often youngh people internalise their roles and continue to act according to them in different groups. So, take it as a scientific fact that you very likey didn’t do anything wrong as a child, nor had a personality trade that was the sole contribute to beeing ostracized.
I didn’t have nearly the same awful relationship with rejection as you, but I had a similar experience as you did at your dance. I’m pretty introverted and rarely join social circles, for a bit of context.
When I went to college, we had a directory of everyone in the building with a picture and name (200 people, more or less). So naturally, we (roommates) picked out our favorites, yet few of us did anything about it. One roommate asked the girl out that he picked (she was my #2), and they ended up dating, and he convinced my to go to dance with him. I went, and he was late (probably making out or something), and my #1 waved me over from across the room, so I went over and talked. We ended up exchanging numbers, dating, and now she’s my wife. Unfortunately, she had already applied to transfer to another school, so we dated long distance for a while before getting married, but it worked out. I still kick myself for waiting so long to ask her out, because we could have spent that time together instead of over video calls.
A bit of confidence can really go a long way, and screw all the kids who reject others in those formative years. When I see my kids do anything similar, I come down on them really hard, because I don’t want my kids to be the reason other kids feel rejected.
It’s not an entirely faulty line of thinking in that environment. Those bastard kids really did do that kind of thing all the time and they found it hilarious. When all your experiences up until that point made such an unexpected scenario seem unlikely, the chances of it being a cruel prank instead probably really are higher or even higher still someone recognising your plight and trying to be charitable whilst not quite realising that that hurts almost as much.
As you probably guessed I didn’t enjoy school a whole lot either. I hope she was sincere though dude. God knows school fucks with your mind.
always assuming that no one could really like me and anyone who acted as if he or she did was just pitying me or playing some cruel prank on me that I was too socially inept to see.
Same, even went to tinder to try to get some validation, but still felt like they were just pitying me and always ended up ghosting my matches and never doing anything besides the initial small talk, it’s a hole that’s very hard to crawl out of.
Uh, what’s your secret to getting matches on Tinder? I can’t imagine trying to meet women in order to feel validated. I did online dating before apps, when people had to have written profiles and send messages. I thought I was writing thoughtful messages to women whose profiles made them seem like they might want to hear from me, but I got ignored so much that it was really hard on my self-esteem.
Am I ugly? My grandma says I’m not ugly…
Edit: I just assumed that you’re a heterosexual man like me, but maybe you’re a woman getting matches from men? That would be very validating, according to what I’ve heard.
Plot twist: Anon was at a college party where everyone else was 20+, so they didn’t want to diddle him
Being called an ugly pimple head for a whole year will also do it
I was at a gathering with some guy friends meeting some girls from a different school. The slightly older brother (let’s call him Jay) of one of my friend’s had driven us there. We were playing spin the bottle outside the apartment building. I was rejected after the bottle spun by a girl saying she didn’t want to kiss me specifically. I got hurt/mad then my impulsive ADHD brain decided to get even. I saw a spigot on the floor, aimed it strait at the girl that rejected me and turned it on. More than the intended target got wet. Jay got really mad and I just ran. Once he caught up to me I thought he was going to beat me up. Instead he just laughed and told me I was going to have to leave and walk home.
At camp some guys and girls were playing in a tent, I was not included.
One got out and told me I could join. I tried to and they all laughed at me. Still hurts a bit.
When I read those, I consider myself lucky. I’m not handsome, normal sized, not athletic at all, not very sociable, closer to poor than rich, yet I never experienced any of those. Always had a few close friends and never have been single for more than 4 consecutive months since my 15th birthday. And I’m almost 40.
Is it a matter of luck? Of countries culture? Of type of schools/univ? Of social groups or generation ? I truly wonder.
You’re probably a nice person and a decent hang. Really that’s what most people are looking for imho
I got a more direct case of rejection. 12yo me, at new school, 2nd week of classes, one of the girls that I thought was very pretty was asking others who they fancied. Once she came up to me, I meekly replied “You”. I got a very loud and angry “I HATE YOU!” as an answer. Up to this day, more than 20 years later, I have no fucking clue to any possible why, in her mind, I deserved that reply.
Lol, that reaction probably haunts her, too. “Why was I so mean to that boy for no fucking reason 20 years ago?!”
Anon should’ve showered more often
Middle school kids he mighta done nothing wrong at all. Those kids at that age are terrors and will oust people from a friend group for the dumbest reasons imaginable.
Sucks because that person may have done everything right and years later still can’t trust people or open up to them.
If there is even just a chance that others wouldn’t understand, let alone disapprove you associating with kid X, you can accomplish 2 things by ousting them: 1. You get rid of the potential disapproval (wich is mostly just insecurity) 2. You help an ingroup getting rid of unambiguousness, by drawing/strengthening the border to the outgroup, while with the same move placing yourself on the inside.
I work with kids, and so far I think this is the objective rationality behind most or at least many acts of cruel exclusion.
The only long term, non authoritarian solution is the kids developing a moral compass, that makes violent exclusion more important to them than short term insecurity-management and of course beeing less insecure. (Plus the “weird ones” often have fluffin interesting perspectives)
As we can see in comments like “shower more” even many adults didn’t recover from the competitive-acceptance-bs other kids/their parents/ this fucked up society gave them.
Ok hol up. I had to read this 10 times. Reads like AI
Are you saying you think kids are quick to push otherness away because they themselves are insecure? And as a bonus, alot of them don’t gain confidence even into adulthood?
I’d just like to say that I didn’t find it read like AI personally
I agree, this does not at all read like GPT
Thank you lol
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do people really get upset about this?
Yes. I’ll dive in, assuming that the greentext is real; the scenario is plausible enough.
Romantic rejection is painful, as it’s based on an instinct to achieve a strong mutual bond with someone else. This may or may not be conflated with a drive to reproduce, depending on the level of sexual attraction involved. The sensation of loss here, can manifest in actual physical pain in one’s head and/or viscera, and is proportional to the level of “drive”. This also gets coupled with a sensation of loss as the reward for achieving that mutuality is a moment that is usually followed by intense pleasure (even without sex); suddenly realizing that reward isn’t coming, hurts.
The second part, where the group continues without Anon, is similar but a different phenomenon. It’s rejection from the entire social group. Our instincts to be social creatures causes us to feel this as a loss (painful), because we’re safer and stronger in groups. Instinctively, the sensation will subside once Anon figures out how be confident with being alone, or (more likely) finds a more compatible social group.
Attempting to introspect the above sensations without support can also go to bad places. Anon mentions his self-esteem - they are blaming themself since that’s a position of “control”, but ignoring the reality that this was all impossible to predict or avoid. In reality, the other partygoers are a bunch of insensitive assholes and carry 100% of the blame here. This person really needs to be around people with more empathy.
Combined, Anon is in a world of physical and psychological pain. They were denied a potential romantic and/or sexual reward, and were rejected by the entire social group. Both forms of rejection provoke instinct and our reward centers in ways that just make a person miserable.
Would you be upset if you found out people considered you ugly?
Disgusting is more accurate.
Remove the romance element from it.
If the bottle spins, someone has to spend time in your company doing something you enjoy. You and your friends all agree. The bottle lands on you, and suddenly whatever it was you enjoy is not just “unenjoyable” but is actively repulsive to the other people. Ironically, I’d expect people to be repulsed by having to do half my hobbies, so this isn’t a perfect reframing.
Apologies if I’m not being sensitive to your thought patterns. But there must be a way of reframing this that you can see why someone would be upset that their “friends” find them actively repulsive to even be around.
I think you’ve got a good approach. I’m not fully allosexual myself, but it seems to me the most painful part of this would be the loss of esteem. To be excluded from anything so blatantly…
People want to be liked. It means social safety, inclusion in a group. Sexuality is just one of its expressions.
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Stop putting your comments in parentheses
Kid just suck.
Eh, they are a less inhibited form of adults, and a product of their upbringing.
They sense and exploit weakness for personal gain. Plenty of adults do that too. That’s where they learn it from.
Yup, and I try very hard to bully my kids whenever they’re bullying others so they get a taste of their own medicine, and reward them when they’re excellent to others for the same reason.
My kid was a selfish brat for a bit, so I completely removed all of my attention for a bit, and I told them exactly why I was doing it. They stewed for a bit, then eventually apologized and I showered them with tons of attention.
Hopefully my kids don’t end up being little terrorists, but if they do, it wasn’t for lack of trying to instill some sense of humanity in them.
Aren’t you teaching them how effective bullying is? And that it’s ok for an adult to use it to get the behavior they want? Or do you face any consequences for your bullying?
I’m being pretty loose with terminology here. I don’t call them names or anything, but I make sure punishments are directly related to how they mistreat others.
For example, if my kid is bullying others at the park, I remove them from the park until they’re ready to apologize or it’s time to go home, and I don’t mind embarrassing them in front of their friends. Playing at the park is a privilege, and I’m happy to revoke that. That said, sometimes my SO will go overboard on punishments, and I’ll step in to protect them if that happens (and they do the same for me). If they are misusing something to bully others (e.g. their bike), I’ll take it away until they apologize.
There’s always a discussion about why the behavior wasn’t acceptable, how they can make it right, and what the consequences are. And every time we make it clear that we love them, it’s just that specific behavior that’s the issue.
It has worked pretty well so far.
Anon self pities instead of self reflecting and fails to grow because of it
I don’t think that we have enough information to draw that conclusion. It is a legit horrible experience though. I can’t imagine what it would be like.
I can’t say I’ve had the exact same experience, but I did get picked on by a bunch of “friends” at a birthday party. Tried to play truth or dare and I was a really honest, open kid (mostly), so when it was my turn I said, “truth” and someone asked me if I’d ever kissed a girl, and I said, “no”. They decided that I had to be lying so they asked me a different question, “have I ever had a crush on a girl” to which I also said, “no”. They didn’t believe that either, and one of them jokingly asked, “have you (me being AMAB) ever kissed a boy?” That was coming from a kid in a really conservative Christian family, and it caught me off-guard. The truth was that no, I had never kissed a boy either, but the question made me hesitate. They lept on that.
Agreed. I think people who blame anon for being in pain fail to see the problem with the behavior of the selfish, stupid people at the party, which is ironic.
I love that elsewhere, someone says anon should have taken more showers, then we have “stinky” with this insightful post.
I don’t think it’s anything more than coincidence, but it makes my brain feel good.
I can. Been there. Couple times. My foster brother and I used to hang out with a bunch of other kids from ages 8-14, and whenever someone had a bright idea for a game like that, completely unprompted would come “but I’m not kissing Dharmacurious.” Shut fucking hurt. I never asked to play those games, never tried to join in. Would try my best to excuse myself before someone suggested a game like that. I didn’t have my first kiss until years and years and years after I lost my virginity, because I only ever did hookups with random strangers online, because I never felt like I was even capable of being desired in anyway other than a quick lay. Being ugly sucks. It truly, honestly does. I shower religiously, I brush my teeth (which, somehow, I still managed to get fucked in that department). Still, I send a picture online, blocked. I’m not an Incel or anything, I don’t think I’m owed a damn thing, it’s just the reality of the situation. I’m a fun, interesting person, with a good sense of humor, thick skin, intelligent, caring, loyal to a fault, and all the other things my shrink has helped me realize. But no one gets to know that, because there has to be some physical attraction for someone to want to get to that point. Can’t fault em for that. But being a bridge troll is lonely, and it sucks. And up thread someone suggested they should shower. That’s a fucked up thing to say, you don’t know their life. And I know green text=fiction, but this one rings fucking true for some of us.
As a kid I was the weird one. It wasn’t my physical attraction, it was just my personality. I’m adhd as fuck and maybe also autistic, so I was hyper around others and couldn’t really read situations/know when to stop talking. I got excluded more times than I can count because of that stuff. These days it feels like my social “success” comes from me muting myself and not having a good time.
I’m sort of the opposite, honestly. People tend to like my personality, but I get a sort of “villagers with pitchforks” reactions to my appearance. Haha. It’s incredible how judgemental the world the is, and how you have to meet so many expectations to get through it. Any little thing off in the wrong direction and you can kiss that traditional life plan goodbye.
What kind of things do you enjoy that you’re unable to engage in to have a good time?
I hear you, man. I’ve found that you just gotta find the right people. After meeting some people where I truly feel like I can be myself, I am now healing. I still struggle to like myself at times, but having people that love me helps.
It’s not exactly what I enjoy that I can’t do, it’s just a general energy/enthusiasm switch. If I’m having a really good time, I usually make lots of comments, can be annoying to other people. I can also get very energetic or silly at times, or heated/invested in a discussion (basically an intensity problem). Unless they see through this and understand my core, they will always be annoyed and put off by that aspect of myself. It’s hard to explain and is something I need to talk to my therapist a lot more about, lol.
Have you made many friends without face-to-face? Like, online friends, phone talking friends, etc? I imagine that’s a good way to find real ones.
silly at times
That’s one I can’t do. I feel like I have to be stoic all the time in person, because I’m a big guy, and I’m unattractive so I have to maintain something to be, idk, respected? I have to really know a person before I can allow myself to be silly around them. My last “boyfriend” cemented that in, too. He dumped me and said he couldn’t deal with the “cutesy shit” took me a while to get past that one. Not the guy, so much. I felt like I had found something I never thought I’d have, and then ending it by saying that… Cut deep.
And I’m lucky on the friend front. I have a lot of long term friendships online, but I also have a few very close IRL friends, and I’m extremely close with my family.
Do you have anyone you can be passionate about things with?
No, I definitely get it. Maybe not exactly the same, but I have been traumatised enough to learn to present myself like an amicable, calm guy(masking culture, limiting my energy levels). I definitely need to get close to someone to allow that side of myself to get out, but sometimes it just comes out without my control if I really feel comfortable. But yeah, the comfort only comes out when I really trust someone.
One of my exes definitely cemented it in too. Shaming me for some behaviors 💀 Then, another ex praised my silliness, so it helped me come out of my shell a bit more. Nowadays I feel like I let out just enough to be a “fun, chill guy”.
Sorry to hear about that cutesy shit comment. That really sucks. If it wasn’t his thing, that’s fine, but to bring you down for it is just a fuckin asshole move. (I’m a proud user of the :3 face lol, it just represents that cheeky cute emotion perfectly)
Glad to hear you have good connections. That’s really what life is about I think. Building connections with others and building yourself up (knowledge, hobbies, wisdom, etc)
I do have my few IRL friends too. 2 really long term ones that have never failed me, another couple stray friends from jobs I’ve had, and most recently a group of musician friends I met last year. It’s the kind of “guy friendgroup” connection I’d been lacking for many years, and they’re all just as weird and hyper-knowledgable in their respective special interests lol. I just love people like that!
I mean, it sucks that you pinned your hopes on your crush having to follow a social pressure to kiss/fondle/fuck/whatever the “forfeit” for spin the bottle was in the first place.
It sucks that you had to go through that, but at what point does that declination of your advances suck less?
I mean, society has unfortunately favoured shitty games like “pull the bull” and “poke the bear” over any sort of genuine attraction which has usually disadvantaged women anyway - that’s not to turn it into a gender thing, but maybe the idea of sparking a relationship from a forced interaction sucks from the outset.
Anon didn’t make up the rules, and I wouldn’t wager that he was the one who decided to start that game. Everyone chose to play knowing they wouldn’t be comfortable getting anon. It doesn’t seem to me like anon made any advance at all. Rejecting someone’s advances for whatever reason is not morally incorrect, nor is denying them physical displays of affection. But going up to someone unprompted and telling them you find them unattractive and wouldn’t feel comfortable touching them is. This seem like an intermediate situation where they willingly and knowingly created a situation where they would have to do the latter. Refusing to kiss or touch anon wasn’t the fault here, initiating the game was.
Its not that serious
It is literally soul-crushing
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Bruh I don’t think I want anybody to play spin the bottle with you
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I’m sorry that you don’t get hugs from friends and family alike I hope you find a good surgeon to give you a face lift
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